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The Logitech Revue and Me: What GoogleTV Will Not Do

Discussion in 'Logitech Revue' started by ticklemeozmo, Aug 4, 2011.

  1. ticklemeozmo

    ticklemeozmo New Member

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    I did not want my first few posts on here to be negative, but Logitech and Google have forced my hand. I desperately want the product to be great, and it has some world-changing ideas, unfortunately they are not implemented.

    I wanted to write something on what GoogleTV will NOT do. With the recent price drop, I, like many others, went out and picked one up. However, after spending 30 mins with it, it becomes painfully obvious why more Revues are being returned than are selling. Do I want you not to pick one up? Absolutely not. I want to pull aside the smoke and mirrors and clarify the intentional vagaries and prevent you from making a mistake if you were picking one up for a certain reason. If you want to watch video on demand on the web, on your TV, this is the device for you!

    In short, with the current version of GoogleTV on a Logitech Revue, I was duped. A device that has the power to change every other IR device in my rack, has the power to run apps, lives under the idea of "open", and promises revolution delivers only a non-configurable searchable guide with a oversized remote (a keyboard).

    I absolutely love the idea of an "overlay" on TV, this prevents my girlfriend from having to switch inputs (I might as well ask her to spin gold from yarn) on my AV rack when we want switch between watching TV or watching local content. I absolutely love the idea that it is an "open" computer which has direct access to the primary display device in my house. Given the POWER and POTENTIAL of such a device, here are a list of items I would want it to do:
    • I want to customize the guide for me. (e.g. block certain channels from showing in my searches or guide, either because I don't pay for them, or I refuse to watch SD content on an HDTV) -- Corrected, see thread below.
    • I want my remote content on my NAS device indexed so I can use the search bar and play it quickly.
    • I want to create a list of favorite programs.
    • I want to use that list of favorite programs and see which of them are on right now.
    • I want to see upcoming airings of shows I like (perhaps, ones in my favorites).
    • I want to find a program in the future and have it tune to the channel at that time.
    • I want to record a program on my DVR.
    • I want to see upcoming recordings.
    • I want to arbitrate conflicting recordings.
    • I want to set up a schedule where certain programs will automatically show (e.g., I wake up at 6:30a, I would like The Weather Channel already tuned when I turn on the TV)
    • I want to set up a schedule where certain programs will ask me to show (e.g., Between the hours of 6p-10p, if Family Guy is on, ask me if I want to tune to it.)
    • I have an Android phone, I want it to a Growl-like display of who is bothering me while I'm watching TV.
    • I would like a one-button "Dashboard"-style overlay to give me the weather, stock info, whatever I choose.
    The Logitech Revue does none of this.

    At every step it seems like I am thwarted:
    • I have the ability to search in the future for a show, HOWEVER, I cannot select "Tune Later", "Record" or "Reminder" to make sure it comes on.
    • I have the ability to select a certain show, HOWEVER, I cannot record it (unless I'm using DISH Network). It's just an IR code, why can't it happen?
    • I have the ability to view my DLNA content, HOWEVER, I cannot search it. Isn't the WHOLE POINT of giving me a keyboard to search????
    • I have the ability to view the TV guide by genre, HOWEVER, I have no ability to add favorite shows/channels.
    Yes, granted, I am an advanced user, but this device seems like it was just made to be an Amazon VOD/Netflix viewer. It is not meant to be a home theatre replacement. But if you are going to put a device in that you are calling "open", runs a computer-based operating system, and uses the biggest information display in my house, you have some big pants to fill.

    I hope some of these short-comings are fixed in the next version.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2011
  2. CatfishRivers

    CatfishRivers Well-Known Member

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    I actually love the Logitech keyboard. It's a nice quality, lightweight and IMO a must if you do a lot of typing (for example chatting on instant messenger, writing emails, etc.) IF you don't do those activities with the Revue and only use it for streaming videos - then yes I could see how a hand-held remote might be more convenient. All of these 'experts' that complain that the Logitech keyboard is cumbersome - all have other forms of internet access to do their typing (such as a computer, ipad, smart phone, etc.). But what they fail to realize is that there are SOME people (such as ex msntv users) that use the Revue as their ONLY internet device. For us the keyboard is a godsend.
     
  3. ticklemeozmo

    ticklemeozmo New Member

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    I do love the keyboard, it's not flimsy and nice and compact, mouse in the perfect spot (needs multi-touch gestures ;)). Although, aren't you just as off-from-the-center-of-the-bell-curve as I am?

    I WANT to use the keyboard to find all my content. The OS prevents me (as described above). Since it can't do what I want it to do, its size becomes apparent.
     
  4. trallyus

    trallyus Active Member

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    You should be able to block channels that you dont want in your search with your google tv. Just go in to your channel setup under settings for the device your using and remove the channels from the device that you do not want to show up. I know it's possible as I did it with my tv setup and removed all the HD channels that it adds since I can't get HD with my old reciever. I can't give you step by step instructions as I am not at my tv at the moment but it can be done if your willing to take the time and not use the default channel setup.
     
  5. sparkyscott21

    sparkyscott21 Moderator Staff Member

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    Comparatively speaking, I love my Keyboard..:cool:
     
  6. Chunkybug

    Chunkybug New Member

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    I think the keyboard is better than the old days of webtv and its keyboard..

    I still have my ole faithful dial up webtvplus sitting in my closet..

    Kev
     
  7. danger-rat

    danger-rat Moderator Staff Member

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    I've just read through the wants list, and I agree with them
    I also think most of them are possible with the leaked HC update, so maybe an official solution is just around the corner.
    There's a large number of these things that are already available in the official release, also...

    Some of the features would rely on third party apps, but I think you can get there with those already available in the Android Market.
     
  8. ticklemeozmo

    ticklemeozmo New Member

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    trallyus is correct, you can block channels from everything. Settings -> TV Source -> Edit Configured Source. This is a good start, although, not ideal (not your fault, you helped find it. :))
     
  9. mightyjimmy

    mightyjimmy New Member

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    How do I add HD channels? I just got the Revue thanks to the price drop. When I go to the Channel lineup or click on a channel to watch, it takes me to the SD channel. I want to delete the SD channel and go to the HD channel.
     
  10. jerseyfirefighter

    jerseyfirefighter New Member

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    Sadly a major downfall to GTV is lack of customization we've all come to love in our android handsets. My take on the matter is that most of the things would have been nice to add into gtv's UI, but some of the more complex and customizable options listed would/should be available by a utility app created by a dev who sees that problem. The biggest hamstring of this device besides the lack of attention to detail from Google devs, is the lack of market support.

    As a developer, you scour these forums and see what the people need from their device, create a prog for it and market it. Since there is not outside dev community support, there will be no major fix outside of the 2.0 update. Remember that this is the initial release of gtv software. It has been long and excruciatingly slow to get to where we will be, but I can relate to the lack of customizable options in gtv as I have seen in android mobile. The solution to that has almost always been by way of a major update, OR a utility app to assist in what google lacks. Have faith in the upcoming update. I think VERY good things are on the horizon.
     
  11. ricocarlos

    ricocarlos New Member

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    It'll record on my Dish system.
     
  12. bobstro

    bobstro New Member

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    Most of this functionality is available on my STB (Charter using a Scientific Atlanta 8300) using the (pug-ugly) Charter interface. My Revue makes accessing these functions much easier, but the underlying functions are still those of the STB. I think this is the answer to your question regarding IR codes: They're not universal or standardized between manufacturers, nor cable providers. I suspect external functions such as DVR will remain hit-or-miss depending on the equipment you have, though hopefully additional equipment will be added. The real shame is that we have to resort to primitive controls like IR due to proprietary standards on cable TV equipment, and FUD from the networks.

    As for the other functions, I too would like to see that functionality. I expect that apps providing these sorts of capabilities will be forthcoming once we gain market access.

    - Bob
     
  13. eferz

    eferz Well-Known Member

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    Actually, the IR codes are pretty standardized within manufacturers, although different models or series may have code differences. Take for example, the Scientific Atlanta Explorer's IR codes is the same for all of the series (like my 8300 and 4240). The same remote can be interchanged with different models and different providers, like Comcast, Time Warner, and Cox. The set-top box will respond appropriately to the remote's codes. The OEM manufacturer of most cable provider remotes is UEI/URC and they create specific remotes for each cable provider. Depending on their request the remotes might have more buttons or less buttons, different names or placements, but the codes that they emit are the same for a particular series.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2011
  14. ChrisG8

    ChrisG8 Well-Known Member

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    It sure looks like a lot is wanted from a $100 box. I wanted a box for web browsing and to stream video from the internet for $100, this one works great. The home theater applications, video and audio, are all covered to my satisfaction with about $10,000 worth of equipment. I didn't want this to change any of that. There is nothing accessible from the internet or from servers that can compare to Blu-ray, SACD, DVD-A, HD DVD, DVD, and CD unless it is just copies of those discs which for the most part, requires defeating digital copy protection and is illegal in the US so I don't do it. Legal high resolution downloads are priced too high or not very good and of no interest to me, I have not purchased a single one. I don't have an iPod.

    Old public domain movies, most unlikely to ever be available in HD, are streamed from various sites and include a lot I have never seen but want to watch. I prefer recent Blockbusters in 1080p on Blu-ray most movie nights but not always, my Revue found "Matango" and "I Bury the Living" and a couple of other movies I wanted to see and enjoyed. About a dozen others await on my queue.

    Of course I have no problem if it is possible to make this little $100 box do a lot more and if sophisticated users expected a lot more, I understand. I am the simplest of users and I didn't want an expensive clunky PC connected to a display and I don't have one connected to an audio system either. Oppo BDP-93, PS3, TiVoHD and a couple other boxes handle most of my needs, the 10% of viewing I plan with the Revue is now covered perfectly.
     
  15. Gutta624

    Gutta624 New Member

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    Couldn't agree more. It's only $100! I wish I had a magic device to do everything I think of also but when my wife wanted to watch Youtube and Vevo videos on my 60 inch, I was sold. Yea, I couldv'e hooked up my laptop via hdmi and changed inputs on the receiver but it kills some of the spontaneity of watching something whenever we feel like it. But now I can watch my Netflix movies (and crackle) without using my PS3 which used to even annoy me. She even turns on Pandora and lets music blast throught the house while cleaning. Add in a full browser which points to HBOGO and other cool sites and I'm happy. It does more than what I expected. And I love the fact that it's Android based so my phone and Sony tablet can control it too. Do you know how many times I've left the TV on but had my tablet with me and just chose "Turn off Google TV" activity? To hell with what it doesn't do, I'm just impressed with what it does do with the current OS...I can only imagine how I'm gonna feel with Honeycomb. "Happy wife, happy life!!!"
     
  16. superdave

    superdave New Member

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    amen... Well said
     
  17. Jacksmyname

    Jacksmyname Member

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    No complaints here either; especially at the $99 price.
    I don't have mine connected with my cable box, as it's a Motorola which limits the HDMI setup.
    I even tried it Motorola>Revue via HDMI>TV via HDMI for picture only, and Revue> AVR via optical for audio. It worked ok that way for the few minutes I tried it, but there were some problems with the picture (Motorola's fault, not the revue).
    So, I just have the Revue hard wired to my router and connected to the TV for picture and to the AVR for audio, and use it as I would any other component in my A/V system. It's function for now is to browse the internet as we would on a PC.
    It works great for what we want it for. We watch GBTV every day with no problems. I'm still pleasantly surprised at how good the picture quality can be, given the fact it's an internet stream. I still have a lot of exploring to do with the Spotlight items.
    I tried the Netflix and Amazon streaming with the free trials. Both had some excellent picture quality, and both had some lousy picture quality. Of course, picture quality is dependent on the source (I give the edge to Netflix). The Revue is capable of giving excellent picture quality. Hopefully they'll get the audio issues corrected with the Honeycomb update.
    Right now I'm researching a switch from cable to satelllite, probably DirecTV, and I'll also subscribe to either Netflix or Amazon (or both).
    The Revue will continue to be a fun part of our home theater setup.
     
  18. arrowrand

    arrowrand New Member

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    I'm going to move some of your comments around so that I don't have to type the same things over and over again.

    No, you weren't duped. Neither Google nor Logitech told you that your Revue would do any of the things on your list. I think had you researched the product a little more (or at all) before you bought it you would have known that your list of wants was not covered. At all.

    No marketing material that I have ever seen for the Revue stated that the device would index and search your local content. Should it? Yes, I think it should. But nobody duped you in to buying a Revue because nobody told you that it would do this. I keep Apple TV devices in my house to make watching local media painless. You could also use a Boxee or something else.

    I call this the recording manager on my DVR. It works great. It's not ideal for your interests, but my DirecTV DVR doesn't even provide me with a list of favorite programs. I have iPad apps that will do it.

    There are a few apps in development for Honeycomb that will do most of these things. I don't know if any will ever see the light of day, but you should get some satisfaction on these before long.

    I have a DirecTV DVR and I can do all of these things using the Revue keyboard to control my DirecTV HR23 DVR. I can search the guide data of my device, I can record a program using the Revue keyboard to control the DVR software and if I set a recording this way that conflicts I am alerted. There isn't some magical way to do this with some super handy Google TV app, but that is not what's needed here in my opinion.

    The SHEF protocols required for DVR access aren't provided by DirecTV at this point. Building in search of DVR recordings and managing the DVR through the Revue interface won't be possible unless or until DirecTV allows Google TV access.

    I'm not sure how Dish DVRs work, but Dish is able to lock you out of their DVR functions as a customer unless you are willing to pay them their $4 fee to use it. Without this type of integration a Dish DVR would be no more useable than a DirecTV DVR or TiVo with the Google TV.

    No thanks. I do not want on screen caller ID from my phone. If I'm watching a sporting event I'll glance down at my phone. If I'm watching a movie or a TV show, I'll return the call when I'm done. Certain members of my family have unique ringtones. Their calls I'll take.

    And now, in rapid fire fashion:
    • I have the ability to search in the future for a show, HOWEVER, I cannot select "Tune Later", "Record" or "Reminder" to make sure it comes on.
    If you use the Revue search feature this is true, if you use the Revue to control your DVR search you can do all of these things.
    • I have the ability to select a certain show, HOWEVER, I cannot record it (unless I'm using DISH Network). It's just an IR code, why can't it happen?
    Again, yes you can do this even if you are on DirecTV. I do it all the time. It's not "just an IR code".
    • I have the ability to view my DLNA content, HOWEVER, I cannot search it. Isn't the WHOLE POINT of giving me a keyboard to search????
    Yes, that is the point, but nobody ever told you that the Revue would go out on your network and index media files so that you could search them. Nobody. There will be apps for Honeycomb that will provide you with better function, but I have no idea if any of them will be able to inject local media files in a standard search from the Revue. Apps can do it on an Android phone, I would imagine that it will work on Google TV as well.
    • I have the ability to view the TV guide by genre, HOWEVER, I have no ability to add favorite shows/channels.
    No you can't, but you will be able to. I prefer to use an app like i.TV on my iPad (and I hear on Android soon) to manage my notifications and favorites. The very last thing that I want is for a notification screen to pop up when I am watching something, or worse, auto changing the channel because something that I thought was a priority when I marked it so just interrupted the new priority that I was just watching.

    It doesn't have anything to do with you being an advanced user, you just want a bunch of TiVo functionality to be built in, and to this point that hasn't happened. And you're right, Google TV IS NOT meant to be a home theater replacement, it is marketed as a complimentary device and that's how I use it. I watch a lot of HBO Go and MAX Go on my TV thanks to my Revue. I use Series search all the time. I've tweeted from it and it's currently my absolute favorite Pandora player.

    Soon, the Revue will do a lot more. Until then, I knew what I was getting when I bought it. A $100 add on device for my home setup. Nothing more, nothing less.
     
  19. surprisinguy

    surprisinguy New Member

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    I was searching for something the other day and at the bottom of the search list was a "media player" entry with a plus in front of it. I clicked it and it listed a video I had with one of the search words. I was surprised....
     
  20. eferz

    eferz Well-Known Member

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    It is a nice feature that it will search the files on the local USB drive. I wished they took it a step further and cached the DLNA catalog of the available files so it could be included in the search.
     

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