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Sony GTV Bluray box or Logitech Revue?

Discussion in 'Google TV General Discussion' started by japyon, Sep 2, 2011.

  1. japyon

    japyon Member

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    Hi, ever since i read about Honeycomb is going to implement into GTV soon (i hope for real this time), I'm really considering getting GTV. Plus the price has come down.

    However, I have trouble deciding which one to get, either Sony GTV box, or Logitech Revue..

    I read CNET review for both box, however, they review them almost a year old... also, I have hard time to find real spec of each box, such as CPU speed, ram size..etc..

    With in-mind of honeycomb maybe coming in soon, I'd like to consider those specs comes in play for deciding factor.

    If anyone can help me giving me more information, or recommendation to which, i'll really appreciate it!

    *it's kind of off-topic, but "SONY is putting all its online services for music, movies, TV, and gaming under a single umbrella: Sony Entertainment Network." do you think SONY GTV box will have access to it as well with future update?*
     
  2. HeathNutso

    HeathNutso New Member

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    Sorry to say this, but unless this 'honeycomb' firmware is something spectacular, I wouldn't purchase the Bluray.

    People may debate this, but it is incapable of doing so many things I won't go into listing them all.

    But, I will say that if the box wasn't a gift to me it would have been returned to Sony. At this point, the only thing I use it for is quick web searches, that's it.

    Do yourself a favor and get a real media player. ;)
     
  3. ChrisG8

    ChrisG8 Well-Known Member

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    I own the Logitech Revue and haven't ever used the Sony Blu-ray/Google TV. If I had needed a Blu-ray player, I would have purchased the Sony version but I didn't, I have several Blu-ray players already. The less expensive Revue was clearly a better deal for me. I love the Revue but I only use it for web browsing and streaming video from the internet. I can't comment as to how well it will handle content from your own network, probably not as well as other devices but I don't have any of that. I won't speculate as to what Sony will do as far as content available for Google TV, I have never seen Sony announce anything.

    Streaming Amazon Prime Instant Video and various sites with public domain movies provides the value with Google TV for me. I don't have cable or satellite TV so it is OTA/Google TV for watching sports and television series.
     
  4. eferz

    eferz Well-Known Member

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    If you consider the specifications mentioned from these resources:

    The Logitech Revue has an 1.2Ghz ATOM CE4100 SoC with 5 GB of Storage vs. Sony NSG-GT1's 1.66Ghz processor and 8 GB of storage. I believe both systems have 1 GB of RAM; however, I can't not verify that upon the available information for the Sony box.

    Unless you need a Blu-Ray player, my recommendation between the two is the Logitech Revue despite the difference in system specifications. One of the best features of the Revue is the included Harmony resource which allows gives you greater compatibility, control, and customization of set-top boxes. The Sony's IR compatibility is rather limited in this regard and doesn't have any degree of customization.

    For example, the control of my Scientific Atlanta Explorers between my Sony Internet TV and the Logitech Revue is rather surprisingly inconsistent. The Logitech Revue has full control of the set-top box with the ability to customize the number of functions from Harmony Database.

    The Sony Internet TV on the other hand requires that I keep the original remote handy because the included Sony Remote Commander (NSG-MR1) is missing a lot of functions it. Especially, the "Yellow A Triangle", "Blue B Box", "Red C Circle", and "Green D Diamond" buttons. These buttons are important because they allow me to acknowledge or make extensive choices with the Explorer's contextual menus. Even though these buttons are represented in the Sony Remote Commander, they are not programmed to interact with my set-top box.

    Since Logitech Revue can download device profiles from the Harmony Database, it has a large compatibility than the Sony Internet TV. For example, the Sony Xbox 360 can be controlled by the Logitech Revue but there's no hope for control on the Sony Internet TV.

    If that's important to you, the Sony Internet TVs and Blu-Ray do come with the Qrocity app which gives you access to the movies and music from the Sony Entertainment Network. Once the Android Market becomes available for the Google TV, I don't believe it will be a proprietary differentiation.
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2011
  5. japyon

    japyon Member

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    thank you guys for responding for my thread!

    They are all very helpful information.

    One thing I'm disappointed about GTV is, I can't just simply connect antenna to it to watch OTA channels. (i do not subscribe cable)
    Therefore, I don't think i'd be able to "google stuff during watching tv" feature.
    However, I watch many online video contents alot, and I do much prefer to watch them on my TV.

    Thank you for eferz, for the detailed spec information.
    I take it Sony has better horse power than Logitech, it seems.

    I read many people talked about Logitech controller (keyboard) is much better than SONY's, however, I wonder, Honeycomb might be better off with decent horse power GTV box... if run several apps at the same times, and such... (just all my assumption).

    For now, I think I'm leaning toward SONY box... over Logitech...

    I'm not in hurry to get one, just yet, so I'd do some more research or wait till honeycomb release to GTV, and read some review ..?

    it does make me wonder if newer box are coming out because price cut of SONY and Logitech going on right now...
    but then, I don't think I can really afford/want to pay $300+ new box..

    i think it'd be really great if android market is open for GTV, and VLC app is available to download to GTV, then, theoritically speaking, we can watch any video with it...
     
  6. HeathNutso

    HeathNutso New Member

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    People make it sound like the Sony/Logitech can play all streamed content from the internet. I can't speak for the Logitech, but anything worth watching on the Sony GTV box comes from pay services. So, if you're thinking you can stream programs from the Discovery Channel or ABC, or just about anywhere else worth watching, forget it. It doesn't work.

    As a media player, the Sony GTV fails miserably. The media player will not play full screen and it can't recognize common containers such as MKV without being streamed from a computer. Try playing any common containers other than AVI and I think WMV directly from a DLNA certified hardware server such as the LG NAS systems and you'll be stuck with playing only your AVI files. Internally, the Sony lacks the proper current codecs to play the more common file formats. And if you're thinking of attaching the Sony to an NAS to access files directly, forget that too. The Sony does not allow it.

    Don't be fooled by people claiming they watch all this great streaming video from the internet. It isn't happening, at least not without paying services such as Netflix and Hulu Plus. Or without connecting to a computer and letting the computer act as a middle man for the Sony box.
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2011
  7. ChrisG8

    ChrisG8 Well-Known Member

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    It depends on what you want to watch. If you have Amazon Prime already, the service costs nothing additional and works great. I have found maybe a dozen sites with free public domain movies, something I specifically wanted but not everybody likes old movies. I spent a few hours with the Project Free TV thread in the general discussion area here, bookmarking sites and putting specific programs in my queue. The result was 100 free programs in my queue, I have watched about 10 of those and it will take months to watch the remaining 90 before I go through the process of finding more programs.

    In my opinion, Google TV isn't enough on its own to cut the cable and be happy but along with TiVo and OTA, we are never going to be without something new to watch, all of it free unless OTA disappears or the free Google TV sites disappear.

    Just my opinion of course and that is no fooling.
     
  8. HeathNutso

    HeathNutso New Member

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    Amazon Prime costs $79 a year. That's great if you always shop with Amazon and the 2 day shipping is worth $6.50 per month for the Prime account. The video may not cost anything extra, but if all you use it for is the video, then you are still paying $6.50 per month for it. ;)

    Don't get me wrong... Google TV was and still is a good idea. I just think it's implementation was not thought out very well.
     
  9. japyon

    japyon Member

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    Thank you guys for more info...

    I did read GTV can't really read many different video files...
    That was why I was hoping maybe VLC app can change that idea...

    At this moment, I might wait till honeycomb comes out and see what ppl say about it..

    Other main thing for me is... I watch many japanese TV online... and I believe they use flash video.. so I'm pretty sure GTV can play those video...

    Since GTV use Chrome browser, I'm assuming it's multi langugage... ?
     
  10. ChrisG8

    ChrisG8 Well-Known Member

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    The sites that prevent Google TV access is hardly anything that Google and its partners could have solved yet and the hardware appears to me to be adequate for the task so I dsagree as to an implementation not very well thought out. With the next update, the functionality is supposed to be improved a lot and if the various owners of sites funded by advertising revenue blocking Google TV should see the light and realize advertising revenue is dependent on viewers, hopefully many will quit blocking viewers using Google TV.
     
  11. eferz

    eferz Well-Known Member

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    I think you're right in regards to the limitation of content availability. However, Google TV was never meant to be used a "cord cutting" platform. During the Edinburgh Festival, Eric Schmidt even said, "We're agnostic when it comes to whether free or paid content models are best. It's up to content owners to decide if they want to charge, and it's up to users to decide if they want to pay. All we want is for content to be accessible to as many people as possible, but that does not mean it has to be free." Google wants to respect the decisions of the content owners, and not circumvent any measures which they have placed to prevent Google TV accessibility.


    Aside from layout of the user interface, the Media Players between Logitech and Sony operate about the same. The limited format support in these applications are due to Google TV's native support of the codecs. Google TV does support the common file containers such as MKV, FLV, MTS, MT2S, TS, AVI, MOV, and MP4. However, it has very limited codec support for encoded audio and video streams which might be encapsulated with the various supported file containers. I posted a list from the support site with my own experience in this thread: http://www.googletvforum.org/forum/...upported-logitech-media-player.html#post11038

    The requirement of codec support for "certified DNLA devices" isn't very demanding. The minimum support for DLNA certified home devices are JPEG, LPCM, and MPEG2. This intended to achieve a baseline for network interoperability, further format support is handled through the synergy between the Digital Media Server and Client. All Digital Media Clients will have a varied amount of codec support. Digital Media Servers can make up for each client's codec support by transcoding for the media into a compatible format. Although, not all DLNA certified servers have transcoding compatible hardware and as owner of such devices, you have the option to preconvert your media with software like Format Factory to a format which all of your clients support.

    In my own DLNA network, I have various clients with different levels support of format support. This includes Logitech Revue, Sony Internet TV, Xbox 360, Playstation 3, iOS tablet and phone and android tablet and phone. My DNLA certified Network Attached Storage (NAS) is a Qnap TS-409 Pro but is does not have the processing prowess to support transcoding. So, I did a little research and I've found the most commonly hardware accelerated format between all of my DNLA clients are MP4 file containers with H.264 video stream and AAC audio stream. By using Format Factory to convert all of my movie files to this format, all of my movies will play flawlessly across all my DNLA clients.
     
  12. les anderson

    les anderson New Member

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    I have both the Sony GT1 and the Revue. Here are some thoughts;

    I bought the Revue first because of the Harmony integration which I thought would allow me to use the Revue as not only a media device/web browser but also as a central control center for all of my home theater devices. This did not end up being true. While there is Harmony integration, Logitech at the last minute decided to limit the number of devices that can be added to 2. So you can add your TV and pre/pro or receiver but not a disc player or anything else. Also, the Revue is supposed to be able to relay commands from a true Harmony remote to the devices it controls- this does not work well at all. The IR blasters on the Revue are fantastic for transmitting- but in terms of receiving IR they are really bad so commands are OFTEN missed. So the moral here is that if your HT has any level of complexity really at all the Revue is not going to be able to control it all. What is even more frustrating, is that Logitech's promo videos for this that can still be found on youtube show it controlling many devices- so this was really a dissapointment. On the other side, the Sony does not even really attempt to control everything. In fact, the code base built in is shockingly small. If you go Sony, please make sure that it can control your AVR if you plan to use it. My Rotel unit was not supported and there was no way to add it, I had to swap it out with a Marantz.

    Remotes- this is a personal preference thing but I would say that the Logitech is better when I am using GTV as a PC replacement/web browser etc. I prefer the Sony when I am consuming media- netflix, etc. One annoying feature of the Sony is that volume control defaults to TV- you shift over to control volume with the AVR. The shift holds for roughly 5 minutes and then when you hit volume again you are controlling the TV. There is a little LED on the remote to show when you are controlling the AVR but this was not well thought out. One other issue withthe Sony in regards to control; It has no IR at all. It can only be controlled via the RF remote or over HDMI. I have a Harmony 1100 that I have programmed to control it via my TV or HDMI but there is some limitation as to what I can do.

    The Sony does seem to have a but more horsepower- I feel like it is a little smoother, however- on youtube there is a video of the Revue running honeycomb and it appears to be butter. I think that the 1.2ghz atom is more than capable of running honeycomb. Even the 800hz Nook Color does a good job with honeycomb!

    Overall, I like the Sony better in day to day use for reasons I cant really quantify in a paragraph or two. It just seems like a better more high quality device to me. PQ on the BRD is pretty good too. The other thing that I really hate about the Logitech is that it nails up a dolby digital 5.1 connection regardless of what the source material is. What this results in is 2ch media (almost all of netflix for example) plays through the left and right channels only since the receiver cannot be set to one of the matrix surround modes (Dolby Pro Logic 2 or DTS NEO) that would steer traffic to the center channel and rear speakers. The Sony recognizes 2ch so my receiver can shift from dolby digital to dts neo or plii and i can get dialogue through the center speaker which is a huge. Logitech has had a year to sort this out and still hasn't done fixed it.

    Both are good deals right now. Both should get 1000% better when Honeycomb hits the street.

    My take on the platform overall is that once the market is released, and we get more people working with these boxes we will eventually be able to circumvent all of the restrictions that the networks have put in place on content. On my phone I can play hulu for example. Between quasi hacking and the platform evolving on its own I think the future is bright. We are long overdue for some improvements so I hope to see honeycomb soon.
     
  13. HeathNutso

    HeathNutso New Member

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    I'm not near my Sony to check, but I do believe it is multi language. I'll check tonight when I get home.

    I agree that Google could not do anything about the networks blocking Google TV. I do however think the networks are being rather ignorant when they block Google TV and other non-pc based systems. There is a huge user base they are losing. And most people have figured out a way around their block anyway (a pc intermediary). So, they may as well open their videos up to everyone again.

    I wasn't going to list the things I think are wrong with the Sony, but it seems to be needed to explain what I mean by poorly implemented. So here are my top 4 problems with the Sony Bluray/Google TV box...

    1) No programmable remote. This eliminates a unified control system for many people.
    2) No NAS support. Requiring a DLNA server is very limiting.
    3) The media player does not play video in full screen mode. No point in trying to watch a movie that doesn't fill the screen.
    4) No static IP option for network setup.

    Because over time I've transferred all of my DVDs, CDs, Bluray movies, etc. to my NAS systems, for me to convert 30TB worth of movies, etc. to a single format that the GTV box is happy with would take me longer than it does to just use a regular media player that supports all formats.

    The Sony GTV box has more than enough memory to include all of the common file formats and to update them as needed. But they haven't done that. If a cheap media player such my ASUS O!Play HDP-R1 can handle them all (both through DLNA and direct NAS AND I haven't found any file format it won't play), there's absolutely no reason the Sony GTV box couldn't too.

    EDIT: I am well aware of the different containers. Even the oplay has had regular updates to account for them. At one time, a certain header compression for MKV files caused the oplay not to play them. But ASUS was quick to react and issued an update to the firmware. Which updating firmware, is something Sony has been very slow with in general.
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2011
  14. japyon

    japyon Member

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    All these information are very helpful!

    for now, I am more leaning toward to SONY box..
     
  15. eferz

    eferz Well-Known Member

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    I'm curious why that is, since 90% of all my movies play in full screen on both the Logitech Revue and Sony Internet TV.


    I understand but at least Format Factory has a queue system so you can "set it and forget it". I had quite a bit movies too, but not as much as you. So, I just setup an old computer and let them convert on their own. It took about a week for all the movies to be converted but it was worth it but I might have a more diverse array of DNLA clients than you.


    I agree, I've often wondered why Google didn't just use libavcodec. This is the library that is used by IP streamers, AV Receivers, and Smart TVs which can play multiple formats with very little issues. I suspect the problem has to do with the trickle down effect with the partnering companies. I understand Intel writes a good deal of the multimedia libraries which Google implements them into Google TV platform, then delivers these updates to Sony and Logitech for redistribution to their customers. However, it seems we're stuck in the air while waiting for the next major release of the operating system.


    While the Sony box is marginally quicker, it also seems less stable. It often has to be rebooted once or twice a day because of some system component crashing. That's not to say the Logitech Revue isn't prone to the same problem; however, I have to reboot it maybe once or twice a week. Sony Media Player's UI of the Media Player is prettier than the Logitech though but it occasionally decides to stop streaming for no apparent reason. This requires me to hit stop then play to resume on the Sony box, whereas Logitech's Media Player plays flawlessly.
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2011
  16. japyon

    japyon Member

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    hmm.... that's good to know...
     
  17. les anderson

    les anderson New Member

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    Both devices are equally stable from my experience.
     
  18. ChrisG8

    ChrisG8 Well-Known Member

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    I am not sure where you come up with some of your complaints but I can't make any sense of this. You haven't offered an explanation and someone might read this believing it is a valid complaint and be misled.

    First of all, I and I will assume almost everybody else will want to watch programming in the proper aspect ratio which will mean the screen won't be filled much of the time. For an HDTV that means anything with an aspect ratio greater than 1.77:1 will have bars on the top and bottom and everything less will have bars on the sides. Everything I have played so far that is formatted properly has played properly by my Google TV. This means every website and everything I have played over the USB input, no exceptions yet. I haven't played much over USB. Yesterday I did play a 1080p HD video over USB which was shot in 16x9 MPEG-4 and displayed perfectly, filling my HD screen.

    If you mean the Google TV won't crop programming to fill the screen, I haven't tried it and don't know but I don't care as I have no interest to crop to fit the screen. I mostly steam video from the internet and everything in 16x9 OAR from websites with a fullscreen option fills my HD screen.
     
  19. CatfishRivers

    CatfishRivers Well-Known Member

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    I had thought that both the Sony and Logitech Google TV devices used the Intel CE 4100 chip? So how is it that Sony Google TV is faster than the Logitech Revue? What chip does the Sony Google TV's use?
     
  20. CatfishRivers

    CatfishRivers Well-Known Member

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    Well I see in that Sony PDF file that Eferz posted - it mentions the Blu Ray player uses a 1.66 GHZ processor. However IMO that doesn't look like an 'official' spec listing - because THEY DON'T LIST THE BRAND AND MODEL NUMBER OF THE PROCESSOR. It might be true - however there were numerous articles (such as these two from last year) - stating that Both the Logitech and Sony Google TV products use the same Intel CE 4100 processor:

    Inside Google TV beats a unique Intel chip | Nanotech - The Circuits Blog - CNET News

    and here is another article from last year stating the same thing:

    http://www.google.com/intl/en/press/pressrel/20100520_googletv.html
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2011

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