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Another Reason Google TV.........

Discussion in 'Google TV General Discussion' started by Rickaren, Dec 16, 2010.

  1. Rickaren

    Rickaren New Member Staff Member

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    Why do they want GTV to fail? I think everyone is jealous of the great potential that Google has with this new box. What do you think?


    CHART OF THE DAY: Another Reason Google TV Is Doomed


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    Read more: CHART OF THE DAY: Another Reason Google TV Is Doomed





    $chart-of-the-day-gaming.jpg
     
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  2. alphawave7

    alphawave7 Moderator Staff Member

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    Article author incorrectly assumes everyone that wants an online portal to television and web is a gamer. ;) Since I'm not a gamer, I'd have no reason to own any of those devices.
     
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  3. Rickaren

    Rickaren New Member Staff Member

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    We must be the only :confused: ones!
     
  4. tvstrategies

    tvstrategies New Member

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    The chart shows what people do with game consoles. That is irrelevant to the discussion of Google TV.

    There are three reasons Google TV has disappointed at first but ultimately succeed:

    1) Availability of content within the Google TV experience.

    The content owners (TV programmers, studios) don't want to disrupt their business models. TV is largely ad driven, and has been since its very early days. So is Google (98% of GOOG's revenue is from advertising). So it's a tug-of-war over ad dollars. The major networks and Hulu are blocking Google TV because no ad revenue sharing deals have been cut. Once they resolve their business issues, the content will flow. It's as simple as that.

    Comcast says that their content won't work on Google TV, and their excuse is that their content is not encoded in the right format for Google TV to decode. Come on now, Comcast is a huge and wealthy company and they have the technical resources to support a Google TV-based receiving device. Just as Google is supporting both Android and iOs for their newly-released Google TV remote app. No, Comcast's reason is competitive - Comcast, correctly, sees Google TV as competition, and they are readying their own device, code named XCalibur. As a sidebar, Comcast is acting as a gatekeeper, which violates the "open networks" and "open services" tenets of Net Neutrality.

    2) Google TV technology is totally misunderstood by industry opinion leaders.

    Most of the industry punditocracy are saying that Google TV's success hinges on the availability of programming, which is only a small part of the situation and is (in my opinion) temporary.

    The other part of the technology discussion is the integration. The only Google TV launch partner that has a clue is DISH Network (with Logitech). They have implemented it correctly - DVR and EPG metadata are handed off to the Google TV search function, so you see a search result that includes them. Real TV through DISH Network, not Web videos from YouTube. If a show turns up in the search result and you want to DVR it, you press the DVR button on the Logitech Revue keyboard and that's it. The other part of the integration is control of the set-top box. This means that DISH had to write software that ties their set-top box, the Revue, and Google TV via their respective APIs.

    3) Google TV is not being merchandised or positioned correctly. Go into a Sony Style store or a Best Buy (both are Google TV launch partners), and it's set up with DirecTV, who hasn't done the integration. Plus, most sales people in consumer electronics shops are not trained, let alone trained on Google TV. I asked random staff in both stores if a Google TV search result included TV programs, and both said "yes" (and the Sony person happened to be the designated "go-to" person for Google TV). So I searched for a popular movie that I know is on pay TV right now, and the only search results were the movie's Web site, a Wikipedia entry, and some trailer videos on YouTube. No pay TV.

    The Sony products use this little game-controller-like remote control, and you have to press a trigger to use the keyboard. Reminiscent of the IBM PC Junior of the early 1980s. And, because the integration has not been done with DirecTV, you quickly get into a mode where you're using the little mouse controller on the Sony remote. To be charitable, I'll just say that this violates the most basic principles of TV UI design 101.

    But Google TV, as a technology and as a tool-set - and as a concept that addresses new expectations about what TV should be - is a really good effort. A little rough around the edges, but we'll see if the updates shipped by Google and Logitech in mid-December made a difference. I know DISH is working on some tweaks also.

    Give it time.

    - Steve
    http://www.tvstrategies.com
    mailto: steve@tvstrategies.com
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2010
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  5. Rickaren

    Rickaren New Member Staff Member

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    I guess the $179 price I paid to DISH for GTV also helped in my enthusiasm for my great new toy. I suspect I would not have purchased it for the $300 list price.
     
  6. Ricky

    Ricky New Member

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    I have to admit to being dumbfounded as to why people are so anti-gtv. I am however used to it. I am an ex-WebTVer and people used to make fun of that platform as well. I never understood it. Google TV is in many ways the next logical step of what was WebTV. Andy Ruben was from WebTV as well and I see a lot of that product in this one only GTV is about 1000% better. Are you kidding me, no subscription, full flash support, works with almost everything. Heck if I can use gmail, amazon and facebook on my 52" TV that pretty much makes my day. If I need to watch ABC I will flip it to ABC, I dont really care if they are blocking it. By the time I make it to TWIT, Revision 3 and Rocketboom well thats all just gravy!

    Also is it not just a little odd that I can watch ABC from my office or from my home on 8 other screens, anywhere I have a PC but not on my TV. Seriously? What makes the PC clicks so valuable, but the GTV clicks worthless?

    I really dont care if there are only 5 other people who purchased this thing, your gonna hve to pry it from my cold dead hands!
     
  7. superfo

    superfo New Member

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    "The major networks and Hulu are blocking Google TV because no ad revenue sharing deals have been cut."

    - If you were the content owners, will you block google TV? And why?

    "Once they resolve their business issues, the content will flow. It's as simple as that."

    It will end up with more ad before you can start watching the content

    "Just as Google is supporting both Android and iOs for their newly-released Google TV remote app."

    - Of course, they do it for support google tv remote (their product) only. I'm sure they will not do it for support Boxee box, WD TV or other media player remote.

    "No, Comcast's reason is competitive - Comcast, correctly, sees Google TV as competition, and they are readying their own device, code named XCalibur. As a sidebar, Comcast is acting as a gatekeeper, which violates the "open networks" and "open services" tenets of Net Neutrality."

    - comcast pay for the contents so they can do any thing with it, google is not willing to pay for the content.
     
  8. Ricky

    Ricky New Member

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    Maybe I am slow but the networks done have deals with Dell or HP for my viewing their content on my office computer or on my laptop in the kitchen, so how is Google TV different? Because TV is in the name and I will be in the living room? I guess since I dont have access to SAT and Cable in those locations its ok for them to sell web ads, but in my living room tey dont want the revenue? I just think they are using flawed logic.
     
  9. gentlefury

    gentlefury New Member

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    So how are so many XBox gamers playing BDs on it?? Odd poll.
     
  10. gentlefury

    gentlefury New Member

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    But Google TV is nothing more than a giant underpowered iMac.......so why is it blocked? Shouldn't this logic lead to Apple, Microsoft, and every browser developer having to pay royalties to content?

    Is this just a way to once again halt progress?
     
  11. superfo

    superfo New Member

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    They want the revenue but they don't want Google get the revenue by using their content for free.
     
  12. superfo

    superfo New Member

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    Apple, Microsoft, and every browser developer don't get revenue from the content but Google TV get revenue from the content. Do you think Google make the Google TV program for free?
     
  13. superfo

    superfo New Member

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    PC clicks -> Network get revenue, GTV clicks -> Network + Google get revenue.

    If you were the content owner, will you let Google get revenue from your content?
     
  14. alphawave7

    alphawave7 Moderator Staff Member

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    Why not? Google isn't advertising my content, it's simply a portal to it. One would need to search (my topic, my title, whatever) to find my content, and Google gives me an opportunity to be found within it's search results. If Google so chooses to market and advertise along the way, I could care less, so long as my content get's listed among the results, and can be accessed by my audience. IOW, I think the copyrights argument is far less compelling than Steve's point about control over the (failing, outdated/moded) business model. Apps (impending in 2011)for specific programs, and search for particular content is where GTV will own this market, and it's demise will not be because ABC/NBC/CBS/FOX hasn't figured out how to play in the 'new' future.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2010
  15. gerryger

    gerryger New Member

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    Couldn't have said it any better.
     
  16. Malachi42

    Malachi42 New Member

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    Personally, I think the reaction of the networks to GTV doesn't have so much to do with ad revenue as it has to do with the contracts they have with their affiliates (ie. your local television stations). GTV creates a viable way for viewers to get network progamming and bypass their local stations.

    I think if Google solves that problem and provides a way for local affiliates to embed content (ie. local commercials) into the stream then the networks would jump on board in a heart beat.
     
  17. alphawave7

    alphawave7 Moderator Staff Member

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    BINGO! I hope Google can achieve that, in some way/shape/form...even if the long-term prognosis for local affiliates isn't rosey, either. :)
     
  18. tvstrategies

    tvstrategies New Member

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    This is an interesting area because the business model for network TV is in the midst of some fundamental change (the networks themselves are forcing some of the changes, and some changes will be forced on them). Fox is forcing one of the changes. They have been trying (successfully) to create a second revenue stream for their programming. The first is the traditional ad revenue stream. The second, which has been enjoyed by "cable" programming (e.g. HBO, Discovery, ESPN, etc) for years, but has not been part of "Network TV"'s revenue stream, has been a monthly charge per pay TV subscriber per month. Fox recently shut down their feed to DISH Network and to Cablevision, and there have been other shutdowns for this reason as well. In the end, Fox apparently has gotten some kind of commitment to get a per-month per-subscriber fee but the terms with DISH and with Cablevision were not made public.

    I don't know if anyone knowledgeable about TV revenue models is watching this thread, but the question I don't know the answer to is the one raised by Malachi42 and noted by Alphawave7 - do local affiliates participate in online programming in any way? I don't think so, but I may simply be unaware. If an online viewer's location can be pinpointed by the access provider, is this information going to the TV networks yet, and therefore, enabling the placement of local affiliate programming and local ad-insertion? Location-based services are being enabled in mobile applications, and by IPTV operators (e.g. AT&T U-verse), but I'm not aware that it's being used yet for online TV.

    Anyone know? I'll cast about elsewhere and see what I can find out too.

    Another change is Apps - I think Apps will become the equivalent of TV channels, and will be the catalyst that finally forces the pay TV programmers to offer a-la-carte programming. Some will be paid, some free, some standalone and some available only via aggregators such as Hulu, Netflix, Boxee, and yes, Google TV.
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2010
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  19. alphawave7

    alphawave7 Moderator Staff Member

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    I doubt local affiliates get any input/benefit from IPTV presently. I know all of the adverts I see in HULU+ so far have been national (and repetitive: Budweiser/Geico/Rembrandt,etc.). We don't know, without some insider input, what arrangement affiliates have in revenue co-mingling with the major networks.

    I agree that apps blow the doors wide open...we get a very nice taste of this with the Roku 'channels' presently. :)
     
  20. tvstrategies

    tvstrategies New Member

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    I've been asking around - some people who work for pay TV companies and industry analysts I know - nobody is yet. Ironic, given the blockade of Google TV by the TV networks!

    Did you see that Google has asked its Google TV partners to pull their products from CES? In today's NYTimes http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/20/technology/20google.html?_r=1

    I wonder if Google flinched? Or is it as they say, to "refine" the software?
     

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